The Persian Race or the "Iranian Race"

Sunday, October 23, 2005

Do Iranians have hooked noses?

You can ask another question. Are Swedes Nordics? No. They are not nordics. Do Swedes look like Africans? Yes. They can look like Africans. How did I get this answer? I included all Swedish citizens in Swede. The problem with the original question is there is no "Iranian Race" to generalize hooked noses about. The Irano-Afghan race is a mixture of Azeris, Persians and Afghans plus 20 other ethnic groups such as Turkomans. This category is called a hooked nose category. In reality there are different ethnic groups in this category and no generalization is possible. Persians (unmixed) do not have hooked noses. Azeris such as President Khatami has a hooked nose. The right question is Do Persians have hooked Noses? and Do Azeris have hooked noses?

Confusing and distorting the concept of racial identity is a favourite method of Azerist position. The Azerist heavily rely on the concept of Caucausian and Mediternaean. They conclude that "Iranian race" is caucausian and mediternean therefore it has a hooked nose. Both these concepts are very unclear applied to the "Iranian race". Mediteranean puts together whites and white looking non-whites as a mediteranean race. Both Arabs and Gypsies are members of mediterranean race. This is despite Iran is not even located near the mediteranean sea. Arabs and Azeris and Persians and Swedes are caucasians. So this concept can not describe anything useful about any race in terms of the nose shape. Some go even as far as saying that "The Persian Lurs have semitic origin". I have posted many picutures showing that Persians do not have hooked noses. Please see here for "Irano-Afghan Race" fraud.

The following is an Azerist point of view concerning hooked nose question. It tries to mix Azeris with Persians and call it "Iranian" to create confusion:

Azerist No.1:
the irano-afghan race does have humped or hooked noses just look at all the thousands of stonecarvings in persepolis (some of them not representing iranian though) but all the iranian ones have hooked noses I was in iran just recently I saw most persians had it, its actually a beutiful thing what it tells you, it tells you that you have not been mixed, besides I rather have a hooked nose than an upright piglooking nose like some "nords"(sorry to alll the nords no personal offense)
the europeans with those noses most likely have iranian ancestors, since "white" europeans dont have the hooked nose rather its more upright Hooked noses are not only with iranians or with those who have a trace of iranian lineage. the europeans with those noses most likely have iranian ancestors, since "white" europeans dont have the hooked nose rather its more upright

Azerist No. 2:
Many Iranians, as well as many Europeans with distant Iranic roots have HUMPED noses. not to be coinfused with hooked noses Other Whites such as Amazigh may also have this trait. You will see many people in Campania ,in Italy the land of my ancestors who because of thois trait might look equally at home in the Zagros or High Atlas. You will see many others with the classicMed triangular Grecian nose, which many Nordics have too, though it tends to be slightly longer at times in Nords. But hooked noses occurr in both groups too Its important not to focus on one single racial trait, with the possible exception of hair texture which seems the most reliable indicator of race of all.

Azerist No.3:
An Irano-Afghan trait. That is, it is more common among Irano-Afghans than other Caucasoid subgroups. That doesn't mean that all or even a majority of Irano-Afghans have this kind of nose, it simply means it's more common in our subgroup than in the other subgroups. I personally haven't seen many Iranians with hooked noses, but I have seen more Iranians with them than I have seen Scandinavians.

Caucasian Definition

In physical anthropology, Caucasian (Varietas Caucasia) is a race that includes most of the natives of Northern, Eastern and Central Europe, West and central Asia, North Africa, and as far east as the Indian subcontinent. This category was first proposed by the German scientist Johann Friedrich Blumenbach (1752-1840), who coined the term in his treatise "On the Natural Varieties of Mankind" in 1775. His studies based the classification of the Caucasian race primarily on skull features, which Blumenbach claimed were optimized by Georgian people, one of the indigenous peoples of the Caucasus.

Later anthropologists such as Carleton Coon have further expanded upon the classification of the Caucasian race proposed by Blumenbach, and have subdivided the group into Nordic, Alpine, Mediterranean, and at times Dinaric and Baltic subdivisions. However, it is clearly observable that many people do not correspond easily to one such subracial type or another.

There is currently extensive debate on the scientific validity of racial classifications, and many people reject systems of racial classification as inherently arbitrary and subject to wide divergences in most populations. But Caucasian remains a common term in North America to describe whites of northern, eastern and western European descent. Southern Europeans are often termed as 'Latins'. Caucasian peoples of Asian, African, or Mediterranean origin are generally excluded from the popular definition of Caucasian. As a matter of fact, the term retains some accuracy only when applied to forensic anthropology in North America. Its relevance is debatable as a physical anthropological, ethnic/cultural or socio-political concept.

While the term Caucasian is still used for the lack of a better word in describing the peoples of western Eurasia, careful speakers generally limit the term to describe the Iberian-Caucasian peoples and the inhabitants of Asia Minor, especially when describing any specific ethnic or cultural traits.

Popularly, the word "white" is used synonymously with "Caucasian" in North America, especially in government terms.

Caucasian (geography)

In geography, the term Caucasian is used to refer to some 40 distinct ethnic groups in the Caucasus region of eastern Europe. For more information on Caucausian ethnology, see the Caucasus article.

Are Azeris Persians?

Are Azeris Persians?: The Azeri nationalist claim that Azeris are Persians but speak Turkish language. They also claim that they originate from Medes.

There are two problems with this theory. First the Azeris do not look like Persians or Kurds. Secondly, the seljuck Turks who are the ancestors of Azeris ruled over the whole Persia. Why the rest of Iran not speaking Azeri language if they impose it on Persia? Why Kurds are not speaking Azeri language?

The remnants of Talish persian speaking minority in Azerbaijan is precisely the proof that Seljuk Turks did not impose Azeri language. Of course those who had Azeri language as their native language spoke Azeri not because it was imposed, but because it was their native language. Not only Seljuk Turks did not impose Azeri language but they even adopted Persian language is the language of the Elite of Seljuks.

I was following a discussion on the Origin of Azeris. Many Iranian Azeris in Iran claim that they only speak a turkish language but they are ethnically Persian. Also Azeri nationalist try to underestimate the number of Iranian Azeris. They claim that Azeris are moving into Persian areas and Azeris are decreasing in number. He further claimed that Azeris are no more than 18 million in Iran. Officially Azeris are 24 million. But the true figure is around 40 million. Somebody estimated that the number of Azeris with mixed persian heritage is not more than 2 to 3 million people. Azeri nationalist claim that most Azeris are partly Persian or they are turkic speaking Persians. Also Azeri nationalist claim Tehran is 20 million in population. The real figure is 12 million people.

But the most interesting exchange was this between a Turk from Turkey and an Iranian Azeri:

Iranian Azeri
Remember Turkic peoples are non-turks who speak or adopted Turkish language and are not ethnically Turks.

Turk from Turkey:
You drive me crazy with such nonsens!!
Böyle piçleri hala ne konusturuyon burda seko??!!
Let me say something to you, you will never ever gonna be an ayran or aryan because "AZERI's ARENT ARYANS"